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October 05, 2005

Comments

teal marie

(What is it with the Marines anyway? It seems that there are no neutral ones.)
I don't understand what you mean. Could you explain further, please?

baldilocks

Most are incredibly heroic and gung-ho (the vast majority). The few bad ones are really bad, however.

In short, there are no moderate Marines.

teal marie

Okay. I agree. The neutral threw me.
Now I'm wondering if this guy was the "White House Leak" in the Plame fiasco.
My brain feels Swiss. In a holey cheese sort of way. Stunned.

Steve

Remember Marine Cpl. Wassef Ali Hassoun whose family is from Utah and who was supposedly "kidnapped" in Iraq, according to Al Jazeera, only to be detained later by the U.S. and was temporarily released before his trial and then subsequently disappeared to Lebanon.

baldilocks: "The few bad ones are really bad, however."

So, you are saying that there are a sizable percentage of marines that can't be trusted?

Is it that they have problems with the United States' foreign and/or domestic policies? Or, they just like to think of themselves as rogue and mercenary? Or, are some willing to do anything to make an extra buck? Or, they always wanted to be in the circus because they can keep 20 Hoola Hoops going?

baldilocks

No. I'm saying what I said.

boinkie

Oh, this is more hilareous than anything....
Background: Estrada, aka "erap" won the popular vote (he was an ex actor) but was found taking (gasp) bribes...so Gloria (arroyo, the president) held demonstrations and he was removed...and then they held an election...and she won...
The trouble was that she was caught on tape discussing how to stuff ballot boxes in Mindinao...and the "hello garci" tapes became a best seller with other pirated cd's on the streets...
Alas, they didn't impeach her because A) the tapes were illegal, and B) her vice president wouldn't be able to run the country.
This "spy" is merely feeding back information on Gloria to those trying to throw her out...

Here in the country, he'd be considered a hero...

In summary: Just normal filippino politics.

epoh

Did you really just write what I think you just wrote?

It's George Bush's fault because it's ultimately the previous administration's fault?

Only a moron comes over to insult a person at her blog and I'm most definitely a moron. Excuse my drool.

trent

Gee, the old "Marine's as extremists" argument. How original. He deserves everything he gets, which I hope is a lifetime of Correctional Specialists at the DB in Ft. Leavenworth bouncing quarters off his bunk.

G

I'm not quite sure how the link to a campaign finance scandal is evidence of spying (after R. Clark's quote)...unless there is something I am missing from the story you linked to?

baldilocks

Trent: My comment about Marines isn't original because it's an old observation. It's like saying " Air Force (my service) personnel are spoiled. Is that original? No. Is it true? Yes.

Or did you just type that to have something to snark on?

G: Granted, Johnny Chung wasn't technically a spy, so I guess Mr. Clarke is totally competent, since Mr. Chung most assuredly passed no secret to the Chinese government.

/sarcasm

Darleen

Re: Richard Clarke

And here I thought the excreble Commander in Chief was reason enough not to watch ABC.

The man had an impeccable background, what vetting does Clarke think that GW's staff would have done differently than Gore's?

It is usually stupidity or serendipity that exposes people doing bad things, be they spies, thieves or murderers.

Marcus Aurelius

Wretchard notes a connection between this Marine and Mark Jimenez who is just getting to the end of a sentence for campaign finance violations.

Wretchard was wondering how the Marine was recruited to help out Erap and lo and behold we have Clinton buddy (or perhaps occasional associate) Mark Jimenez in the Whitehouse during certain key times.

No, I don't believe this guy has a thing to do with Al-Qaeda but anything that keeps things stirred up in the Philippines is helpful to Al-Qaida, and that is something that would take volumes to cover fully.

G

It is not Clarke's competency so much as the factual basis for his statement that I was questioning. You are making a leap of assumption not grounded in any known facts to say that he should 'know' the same thing you assume...Not to say that there were no secrets passed to the Chinese - I certainly don't have the connection to know either way. All I am saying is that it is false to say that Clarke is wrong in this instance, simply because he does not share your assumption.

Ben

Richard Clark said, "I don't know of a case where the vetting broke down before and resulted in a spy being in the White House."

You say he's wrong and link to, "Johnny Chung, 43, who delivered a $50,000 campaign contribution to the White House and escorted Chinese businessmen to a presidential radio address..."

Ummmmm... maybe Clark meant "in the White House" in the sense of "worked undetected at the White House for almost three years", not cruising through with a political contributor or favor seeker in tow.

Drop the baseball bat and back away from Mr. Clark.

justin

Granted, Johnny Chung wasn't technically a spy, so I guess Mr. Clarke is totally competent, since Mr. Chung most assuredly passed no secret to the Chinese government.

The Johnny Chung affair was/is a black mark for both Clinton and Kerry, but it was about access and favors, not spying.

baldilocks

Ben: Are you hallucinating? I don't even own a baseball bat. And Mr. Clarke is a big boy. He doesn't need you to protect him from some chick in South Central LA.

baldilocks

G and Justin: Fine. Mr. Chung wasn't a spy.

The larger issue however is security of our country and, observing Mr. Clarke's performance in both the Clinton and Bush Administrations, he isn't in a position to cast aspersions on any breech of same.

deb

All the hooplah in the MSM about a spy in "Clinton's White House".

Don't you find the lack of hooplah of this "coincidental"?

Pentagon Analyst Pleads Guilty in Spy Case

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/10/05/AR2005100501920.html


-Deb

justin

The larger issue however is security of our country and, observing Mr. Clarke's performance in both the Clinton and Bush Administrations, he isn't in a position to cast aspersions on any breech of same.

I think he performed admirably in both administrations. Is there something I'm missing?

Trent

If you took the comment to be snarky, then so be it, but I took your saying Marines are either really good or really bad as snarky too. If having a love of God, Country and Corps and willing to defend them all with my life is an extreme view, then count me in.

Almost all media truly believe Marines are extremists and they will always try to make the Corps look bad. Name the last soldier, sailor, or airman who was found to be selling/giving secrets to a foreign country. I only can because I have several who work for me and are serving time.

baldilocks

Trent: It isn't my fault that you took the extreme comment to be an insult. It's yours. (See Barry Goldwater.)

You need to step back and take a look around here before you come to a judgment about my statement. My two years of blogging speak for itself about what I think of the entire military and Marines specifically. If you are making a snap judgment about that, it's your problem, not mine.

Semper Fi and God bless.

boinkie: Yes, it's normal Filippino politics. Just don't be saying that like it's a *good* thing.

trent

True enough. It wasn't a snap judgement as much as coming to the defense of the Corps.

I now can sleep fitfully tonight knowing that I fall into Barry Goldwater's category. I think I am in urgent need of counselling!

IaintBacchus

"Name the last soldier, sailor, or airman who was found to be selling/giving secrets to a foreign country. "

Oooh! Oooh! Oooh! Pick me please!

The Walker spy ring were squids, weren't they?
And the people they were sell secrets too were really our enemies, weren't they?

Semper Fi

John Gillnitz

Clarke is incorrect. The vetting process doesn't do anything if the crime is committed after the person has been vetted.

Still, I don't know why y'all are so hard on Clarke. After reading his book I was more inclined to use the military for anti-terrorism. It made me less of a moonbat. He went after Bush, but on an issue Bush had been lax on.

baldilocks

trent: LOL! I'll pray for you.

IaintBacchus: There are some more recent than the Walkers.

John Gillnitz:

Still, I don't know why y'all are so hard on Clarke. After reading his book I was more inclined to use the military for anti-terrorism. It made me less of a moonbat.

Well, then Mr. Clarke is useful after all. ;-)

Langtry

Wasn't Chung connected to a Chinese firm that received classified satellite technology? IIRC, Clinton had given either Chung or John Huang an introduction to a pentagon staff member, and he claimed Chung/Huang was a legitimate businessman and that Chung/Huang's contributions (at Clinton's infamous White House "coffees") had in no way bought the introfuction?

Clarke was sleeping on more than just a couple cases of espionage while he was leading the anti-terrorism fight.

DarkStar

This was a break down in the security clearance vetting process. That process spans many people and a couple of federal agencies.

This is one that's bound to happen again.

Merry Whitney

Johnny Chung was a small business owner (Chinese Restaurant I think) from Little Rock; John Huang was linked to Mr. Wu, who was one of, or directly tied to, the boys from Beijing.

There was a prohibited technology transfer to China from a US corp., waiver granted by Clinton let the US execs off the prosecutorial hook, but I don't recall whether Huang and/or Wu were part of that.

I think Baldilock's Barry Goldwater reference alludes to his statement, "Extremism in the pursuit of liberty is no vice; moderation in ... (help me out here?) ... is no virtue."

Good one, if I'm right?

StinKerr

"...and moderation in the pursuit of justice, is no virtue."

At least that's what I found with the search engine. You piqued my curiosity, MW.

StinKerr

It'll happen again as long as there is lax oversight of what people are doing.

The vetting process won't predict what someone will or won't do in a given situation. It will only detail what they have done in the past and what their friends, neighbors, teachers and former employers say about them.

Keep a clean criminal record and be on good terms with the neighbors and you'll get a clearance with no problem.

The only way to prevent crimes this is to limit access to material and supervise what people do with the material they work with.

Sending classified docs out of the White House through a Yahoo or HotMail account should be caught the first time.

I can assure you that private industry keeps a better eye on employee email activities, if only to track "feelthy peek-chures".

Salvo

Given the fact that the Philippines has deep connections to Al-Quieda and other islamofascists, there gov't are historically corrupt, and there port security is leaky as a sieve, and there are MANY illegal Filipinos in the USA, I think the only reasonable thing to do at this point is to put all Filipinos in internment camps.

This is for the safety and security of our nation.

I'm sure Michelle Malkin would agree.

LTJ

The main faux pas by Richard Clarke was that he dared to criticize an Administration with a well-known inability to take criticism or admit mistakes (any mistakes). The list of people (many high-level) who have been smeared in retaliation for such criticism is starting to get rather long: Clarke, Paul O'Neill, Joseph Wilson, Gen. Eric Shinseki, Scott Ritter, Cindy Sheehan ....
It's funny how they all turn out to be such bad, bad people -- what a coincidence!

teal marie

I guess treason is contagious. Sort of like BDS and STD.

torchy

The love of money is the root of all evil. Alot of people will sell their access, usually at some particular height of access, even after decades of faithful service. Even after their access comes to an end some will write a book that impugns the intergrity and competence of a sitting administration based on prior access. It's a good sales strategy. whether or not it's true. Heck,I'd sell my access for a banana cream pie about right now

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