Living Up To Ideals

How do I blog about the news when one story stands so far out from the others that the rest seem like the frivolous BS of an indulgent and indulged people? Sure, grill the members of the Bush Administration over the coals using ‘damned-if-you-do/damned-if-you-don’t’ standards that no sane person/entity would ever use when its survival is a stake. And it is our survival that’s at stake, folks; those of us that espouse and live by Western and liberal (small ‘l’) values; those of us that value Judeo-Christian ethics. You know the ones I’m talking about, right? Come on, sure you do. They are the ones that cause us to double over in horror and scream in rage over photos like these (extremely graphic) and what they depict.

However, I had to calm down, re-group and think. I’ve seen stuff like this before or at least the generations before me have, right here in this country. I’ve even blogged about it before.

Back in the days when information didn’t flow so freely, American terrorists like these--who would commit acts equally as heinous—flourished and often got away scot- and conviction-free. Just forty-plus years ago—my lifetime--this sort of thing got either approval or cowed silence from those who knew about it.

So what’s the difference?

When these acts became known and documented, a large portion of Americans started to ask its government—its leaders--to live up to the laws that had been set down by their forefathers and, before them, by the Father, Himself. The people demanded that America actually be what it claimed to be. And it worked. Why? Because the idea, the foundation of America wasn’t and isn’t based on a murderous ideology.

Can we say the same of any Islam-based country/nation/society?

From where I sit, such atrocities are to be expected from a society that is Islamic in origin.

(Thanks, ironically, to Allah)

AFTERTHOUGHT: Remember Professor “Million Mogidishus?” Well he must have been feeling pretty smug today. One down, 999,999 to go. (Thanks for reminding me, Oriental Redneck.)

Comments

[MommaBear]

MB remembers to this day the photographs in Life Magazine that began to come back from Germany as the concentration camps were liberated...these are all too similar!!

When will the world learn that evil must be stamped out wherever it rears its ugly sick head.

[walter]

Actually, I think you mean the "liberal" with a big "L". Liberalism with a big L, as in Liberal Democracy, is based on a philosophy, whereas liberal with a small "l" is a political designation.

[samkit]

kill every last one of the bastards.

[Rey]

Kill them all for God will surely know his own.
Rey

[feste]

I had exactly the same thought Juliette. Why does the party who spoke out against their own Southern base and passed legislation effectively ending Jim Crow and government-sanctioned segregation not see the similarities?

From time to time this or that host on talk radio cracks wise that Liberalism is a psychosis. It always made me cringe...but I'm beginning to wonder.

[Lester Spence]

there are a few problems with the narrative juliette.

if you're talking about lynching and terrorism weighed against black people, you're talking about at least 100 years of it (lynching begins in earnest after enslaved africans are freed). it doesn't stop because of "information" but because of agitation.

when does terrorism by muslims START? surely we've had states run by and for muslims before? isn't there something different about this particular period? you say these atrocities are to be "expected." compared to what? a black woman being lynched and having her fetus ripped out of her body because her husband had the audacity to want to be a postman?

[baldilocks]

The problem is not in my narrative, Lester, but there is definitely a problem: your reading of it.

I compared to the two ideologies for which each group bases—or claims to base their lives upon: the Judeo-Christian set of ethics and the Islamic set of ethics. I said as much.

One exhorts the believer to violence against the unbeliever. The other does not.

The Muslim credo is based on vilolence, or am I somehow misinterpreting the exhortation to "kill the Infidel wherever you find him?"

Based on that, the chance that any Islamic culture will cease to prey on the weak or lynch those who are trying to guard their food supplies (as these poor guys were doing) is
low, in my estimation. They don't have an ideology, religious or otherwise, to live up to that tells them that this is wrong.

[baldilocks]

I can't see a Muslim equivalent of Martin Luther King coming up and asking Muslims to "live up to their own ideals." The lynchers of Fallujah already were doing that when they committed those acts.

[Rae]

This just makes me physically ill. I absolutely cannot understand the people that are so annoyed that "the Americans" came and removed their "most beloved leader". You know, the one who brutally murdered any who disagreed with him, didn't like his shoes, or breathed funny. The one who kept them in poverty and near starvation while he languished in palaces and fattened himself on the bread of their children. The one who denied them education and the opportunity for prosperity and the benefits of technology and modern medicine. I know one thing, they will answer if not in this life, most definitely in the next.

I wonder if their attachment to him is like the strangely fierce dedication that an abused child many times feels toward the abusing parent? It's like they have lived with dysfunction for so long, they are afraid of what their lives will be without it.

My heart is full and my prayers intensified for the families of the ones who died and again for the safety of those who remain in Iraq.

[Lola]

I remember reading about a Muslim group that carried out terrorist attacks during the Crusade era. They were called The Assassins. Here's something I dung up:

Assassins: The Prototype of Terror

and some historic background:

[Lola]

and some historic background:

Assassins

It seems that they targeted both Christians and Muslims alike. From what I understand, the Ismailis trace their line back to them.

[A Wild Rant]

Very nice piece. It does appear that a critical mass of Iraqis in the "Sunni Triangle" are unwilling to commit to a sane political order. The very idea that so many of these people (hundreds, it appears) were willing to dance in the streets over the murder of people who were trying to SUPPLY THEM WITH WATER is just insane. The gut-level reaction is simple: screw them. Let them rot in infected water and piss in their own wells. If they rise up in protest, shoot them where they stand. Only when they come begging for food, water and a reasonable compromise with a rational government should they be permitted back in the fold.

Bastards...

[Andy Freeman]

> Why does the party who spoke out against their own Southern base and passed legislation effectively ending Jim Crow and government-sanctioned segregation not see the similarities?

Huh? The party that passed legislation ending Jim Crow didn't have a southern base.

Congressional Repubs provided the majority of the votes for the 60s civil rights legislation. At that time, Repubs had no significant presence in the south, and hadn't since Reconstruction. The Dems, the folks who instituted Jim Crow, mostly voted against the 60s civil rights legislation.

Bull Connor was the head of the local Democrat party organization and was a delegate to the national conventions.

[Val Prieto]

Another really sad part about this is that I'm sure there are some Muslims that find this sort of behavior atrocious. But, if they themsleves do not stand up and call it what it is, as opposed to cowering in the background, then they too are indirectly perpetrating said behavior.

[Tony]

Thanks for the linkage, Juliette. You know, I'm a tad surprised that the de Genova thing hasn't circulated much, given the inflammatory nature of his comments.

[La Shawn Barber]

Muslim's just can't seem to get along with their neighbors, centuries' worth of not getting along.

[Rae]

I agree, La Shawn. ITA. And it is true that there are some peaceful Muslims; some.

[Justin Levine]

Hit the nail on the head Baldi...

[joel]

This behavior crossed a line, much like the use of young women for suicide bombers in Israel crossed a line, at least for me. Here is an adversary from whom no mercy is to be expected and for whom no mercy is to be shown.

The similarities between the Sunni's and the Palestinians are obvious. They rather teach hatred and practice violence than take positive action to improve their situation. And, they are incompetent and stupid.

That city should be writen out of any plans by the US led coalition for aid, water, food, improvements of any kind, or jobs, etc. Let the new Iraqi govt (Shiia dominated) settle with them.

Now we know why the kings of old were wont just to destroy an entire city if it misbehaved. Likely, they found it emotionally satisfying.

And, if they are like the Palestinians, they will squeal loudly when justice is done to them.

Joel

[Lester Spence]

juliette i'm not that familiar with the qu'ran. could you give me a citation for your reference?

could you also tell me if this type of activity is a constant over the history of the region? if we go back to 1905 for example, would we see someone lynched then?

finally, could you tell me how lynching and mass terrorism against african americans was able to continue for a full 100 years, WITHOUT reference to the judeo-christian ethic?

[baldilocks]

Lester: I'll do the research that you ask. It will likely have a post of its own, since I found myself having already typed a 150 word response to your last missive.

BTW I don't understand your last request. Are you asking *me* not to refer to the Judeo-Christian ethic when talking about American terrorism or are you saying that there were absolutely no references to this ethic during the time period that you specified? Or are you saying that any references had no effect?

[Fausta]

http://belmontclub.blogspot.com/2004_04_01_belmontclub_archive.html#108086661437741372
The Anti-Mogadishu

[baldilocks]

BTW, Lester, I'll take the high road and assume that you meant the non-acronym capital letters strictly for emphasis, rather than what they generally indicate in Internet communications. This once.

[Isome]

They rejoiced over the deaths of people who only wanted to bring them water? That is so far from true, it's frightening! It is more like they rejoiced over the deaths of those they believed have cause so much suffering in their country and/or are there to PROFIT from it. (I personally know of someone who lobbied for a contracting job in Iraq because it will net him a six-figure check after his "tour" has ended.)

Concluding that 1.2 billion people (Muslims) are worthy of scorn and contempt based on their fighting an occupying army is amazing. The bible is used to justify this illegal invasion and occupation (and other wars history has deemed unjust), the enslavement of Africans, and segregation. Does that mean Christians have nothing in their dogma/doctrine/teachings that holds them to evolved standards of humanity?

It's puzzling that the proper context is not given to the violent actions of the Iraqis. Either it is done on purpose, or it is not done because of true ideology-induced blindness.

If another country invaded the US and proclaimed it was only here to help the anti-Bush contingency rid itself of an incompetent and dangerous leader, and to help us establish a better democratic government, would those who fought (in any way they could) against the invaders be considered in the same way as the Iraqis who fight today? I am as anti-Bush as I can be, yet, should another country purport to want to help me by invading, I would turn pro-Bush and anti-invader.

It's only natural for a country's citizens to balk (violently, even) at another government deciding what is best for them while dismissing dead friends and loved ones as unavoidable collateral damage. I, too, would be rejoicing at the death of anyone who dared to invade my country and/or profit (civilian contractors) from the misery that invasion wrought.

[baldilocks]

Oh, I forgot. People who make a lot of money deserve to die horrible deaths and have their bodies desecrated before the world, regardless of whether they are doing good or not. /sarcasm

The jealousy over another’s money is almost as disgusting as the murders.

Concluding that 1.2 billion people (Muslims) are worthy of scorn and contempt based on their fighting an occupying army is amazing.

Either read my blog post in its context or don’t. You want to twist what I said to suit your own beliefs? Do it elsewhere.

[Isome]

There has been a gross, yet predictable misinterpretation of what I posted.

...jealousy over money? Nowhere could one *logically* conclude there was any jealousy expressed. There was, however, true disdain directed towards those who profess belief in the lie of WMD & liberation of Iraqis, choose to travel 8,000 miles to get a piece of the war profits, but be completely ignorant, surprised, shocked & indignant to the natural resentment of those whose friends & relatives were killed, and whose livelihoods were decimated, in the course of searching for the not-yet-found WMD and the implementation of the alleged liberation.

Though I didn't say all of that in the first post, the *context* was clear, as was the context of your comments. You wrote:

"Can we say the same of any Islam-based country/nation/society?

From where I sit, such atrocities are to be expected from a society that is Islamic in origin."

Your comments are indicate that you do hold "1.2 billion people (Muslims)" in "scorn and contempt" because of what happened to the mercenaries & contractors in Fallujah. You obviously do not agree with my assessment of your comments --the reverse is true, no doubt-- but that does not mean I didn't put them in their proper context. Clearly I did.

The Christian bible & 'talks with GOD' being used to justify this war by Americans has not been rebutted. There are some who support exporting death and destruction in the name of instituting "democracy" (small "d"), and believe that the GOD of Judeo-Christian ethos wills it. They are no different than the fanatical fundamentalists of other religions.